F10 is a global innovation ecosystem with offices in Zurich, Singapore, Madrid, Barcelona.  Our founding sponsor is SIX, a global financial infrastructure provider and operator of the Swiss and Spanish stock exchanges. Today it is joined by a global cohort of influential banks, consultancies, insurers and tech firms.

Script of Interview

Interviewee                                 Mr. Jonas Thuerig (JT)

Position                                       Head

Company name                          F10, Singapore

Company website URL             https://www.f10.global

Interviewer                                 John D. Evans, CFA (JE)

Interview conducted on           4th December 2020

About Jonas Thuerig

JE: Good afternoon, we’re speaking with Mr. Jonas Thuerig, who is the head of the F10 incubator and accelerator in Singapore. Good afternoon, Jonas. Let’s start off by telling the viewers a little bit of a brief personal view of yourself. And also combine that with a professional overview, what you’ve studied and what you’ve done in the workforce so far.

JT: Yeah, happy to do so. So originally, as you can hear maybe, I’m from Switzerland. And now, in this year, actually, I’m living here in Singapore. And let me start off with my background. My studies, originally, I was actually trained as a as a web developer. That’s how I started out into my professional career. And then I went on into international management and economic studies and did my bachelor in that area. And I also hold a Master’s in Business Administration. Professionally, I think important or interesting against when I talk about my startup history. So, I am myself, a former founder. I had a startup and more in the IoT space. We were offering solutions in Switzerland and then also internationalized, had several projects in Germany and raised the successful series A.  Unfortunately, it didn’t work out, but it was an incredible journey over five years. After that, I joined SIX group in Zurich, which is also one of our main sponsors of the F10. I joined the team there for two years, mainly in a transformation project. But Asia was always of a big interest to me. So, I decided to make the move and I found an incredibly interesting role at the Swiss embassy in Beijing where I was the deputy head of science, technology and education. One of our main task controls there was that we would bring Swiss startups to China that I had startups coming over. We did several roadshows with them, introduced them to potential investors as well as clients and I really enjoy that role. And basically since this year, I am having this role as head of F10 year in Singapore, obviously not related to the embassy, I left the embassy and went back into the financial service industry where also, I made my experience working at SIX, and basically can now combine my startup experience together with my experience in the financial service industry, as well as my experience of having worked for a platform and at the end of the day, we need the one thing we can do quite well together for me in this role.

JE: Okay, very interesting. Now, I know this year, travel has been constrained because of the pandemic. But now that you’re in Singapore running this business, when travel restrictions end, are you likely to have to travel a lot for your business to either see startup companies for F10 in Singapore? Will it be a job that requires a lot of travel in the future?

JT: Yeah, I think definitely traveling will be part of my job. We are here to attract the talent from the region. So, I will definitely be traveling to different kinds of startup events in the region of Southeast Asia mainly. FinTech events, really connecting with the ecosystem and we are also looking for corporate partners joining our platform, which obviously many of them are in Singapore, but not all of them. So, I would also be traveling for time.

JE: Okay, that’s very interesting. Now, I know you’re going to be involved with different companies, corporate partners. So, is running F10 in Singapore your only activity or do you
either have now or in the future other projects, other directorships in some of these corporate partners and will it broaden out to more projects than just running F10?

JT: I think, in general, a lot of work already. So, I don’t think there is at the moment, a lot of capacity to bring onboard new projects. I think we definitely want to grow F10 start-up input, first and foremost, and we want to bring on new members. And I think we will always be looking at improving and increasing our offering to our corporate partners, as well as to our startups. But in terms of other directorships, I just don’t see that at the moment happening. Okay, at least not in the short term.

About F10 and F10 Singapore

JE: Okay, well, you started to talk a little bit directly about F10. In Singapore. So, let’s focus our discussion on the entity that you’re heading up now. Give us a brief history of both F10 and F10 in Singapore; when they were founded and sort of any sort of major events and timeline to date of the two entities, but particularly your own.

JT: Yes, happy to do so. F10 was actually founded five years ago in Switzerland in Zurich, where SIX Group is, which is the infrastructure provider of the Swiss financial industry. Then the private bank Julius Baer and PwC, Switzerland came together to foster the Swiss FinTech ecosystem to foster corporate innovation by collaborating with startups. And the platform has now grown into a platform within Switzerland with 12 to 13 members at the moment. These are from banks, insurers, or other players in the financial services industry. And, yeah, so we have that platform on the one hand, obviously, with our corporate partners, which are interested in engaging with startups and seeing what was out there and basically applying that to their businesses. And then on the other hand, we have, obviously the startups so we have had over 120, startups that went through our various programs. And that incubator is basically through us. And that’s the second, the second most important stakeholders of our platform. And then the third stakeholders are the investors. So, the investors are looking for high quality, deal flow. And that’s also something we can provide by our curated program. And when I talk about programs, I talk about two flagship programs that we are at the moment running: one is the incubation program, that’s the program for early- stage startup. These start-ups are mostly pre revenue, they don’t have revenue yet. But they have a prototype and running. And they want to further develop that into a finished product and get buy-in. So, they come on board, and they join our five-month program when we are very targeted on different areas. And every month, we meet with them for one or two weeks. So, we basically start out with
ideation at first, then second, effectively, we work on prototyping, then we work on business development, and also legal questions all the way to getting the investor ready with the fundraising, and with the fundraising fundamentals and then investors at the end. in the second program that we are running is the acceleration program. That’s the three-month program. And that program focuses on startups that are a bit later stage. So, they have already raised at least half a million and they are also post revenue; so, they make revenue and do have paying customers. And this program is much more focused on business development, on scaling an organization and again on fundraising and getting them ready for the next round. And so, I talked about the program, I talked about how we started and basically since this year we are in Singapore. So, we have launched our first program in May here in Singapore, the incubation program, the one for the early stage, startups. And now in December, we have also launched the acceleration program. Singapore is the second hub outside of Switzerland. And this year, additionally, we also expanded into Spain. So, we have a third hub, which is Spain, we are launching the first program there in March. And then yeah, very excited for such a global setup and three hubs across the globe between Europe and Asia now. Europe, Switzerland and Asia. So, I think that’s a very exciting moment and value proposition that we can leverage on both sides for the startups as well as our corporate partners.

JE: So, let me just focus on one thing here because you’ve talked about the programs. So, we’ve gone ahead into that. But I want to know how the soon-to-be three entities Switzerland, Singapore, and Spain will sort of work, will they be somewhat independent focusing on startups in their own areas? Or will startups be getting master classes in all three? How exactly will the three centers interact and/or integrate in their business together?

JT: Yeah, so I think, yeah, first and foremost, every hub is focusing on the program, in their hub and on the corporate partners and start-ups in that area. But of course, we can also leverage the network, so I can give you actually a very interesting example. We have a startup called APIX, they went through the incubation program in 2017, in Switzerland, very successfully established themselves in Switzerland and grew there with a number of very prominent clients. And they have now expanded to Asia actually, earlier this year. And since this week, they are part of our acceleration program here in Singapore. So that’s the program that is for later stage startup. And we basically bring them into Southeast Asia into the Singaporean ecosystem, we introduced them to our partners here. And I think that’s a great success story of how things can play out in the startup ecosystem, successfully setting themselves up after the incubation program, they can then later on join one of our other hubs. And we will help them to scale.

JE: So, is it the case that a startup would choose the location based on where it’s wants to grow its business, it’s not the case that if you’re in an ASEAN and country, you can only apply to Singapore? Or if you’re in the EU, you can only apply to Barcelona? Is it the startups choice about where they want to focus their business that will determine which of the three centers they would apply to?

JT: Absolutely, though, really depend on their go to market strategy and whether they have an offering for the local market they apply to. So, yeah, really about the strategy of the startup and also the appetite and interest of our corporate partners of which startup they want to have in the program.

JE: Okay. Now, I want to focus a little bit more on the corporate partners. That was a bullet point I had, you emphasized three: the SIX group, Bank Julius Baer and PwC. So, what exactly does a corporate partner contribute or do and are they also owners of F10? Are they financing it in in some way?

JT: Yeah, so the revenue model of F10 at the moment is very much driven by our corporate partners. So, our corporate partners, when I talk about corporate partners, these are like I said, bank or insurers, or other players in the financial services industry, we also have, for example, R3 which is a blockchain technology provider, very strong in the in the financial services industry and so, they are, they have different, different interests. When they join the F10, we also have two offerings, so we have a strategic partnership or an innovation partnership. Like I said, I mean, the main value we can add to them is open innovation. They are looking for the trends out there. We have a curated program; we make sure that these startups are ready for collaboration upon graduation. And we basically give the corporate a way to interact with startups and about having a reduced investment from their side because they don’t need to take all the risk and they will be going through our program and not directly going into the bank. So, gives the corporate some comfort.

JE: So, let me just follow up on that. So, I understand the corporate backer now. And they get a lot of synergies as it provides them with a lot of interesting new entities for them to look at in
the future. But what about the actual legal structure and ownership of F10? Is it a limited liability company? Are some of the corporate backers the shareholders who actually owns F10 legally?

JT: Yeah, actually, I think we need to talk about it. The point is that the moment that at the moment, we are an association.

JE: Okay. Tell us a little bit about the F10. Singapore entity. It’s got its own premises, number of staffs, are the startups sitting in your office there? What are the logistics?

JT: Yeah, great question. I think it’s a special time of the day at the moment. But we are quite the lean team here; we’re a team of four. So, we have a program success lead, who is really running through the program, making sure that we run our incubation and acceleration programs. Then we have startup coach and that is basically on a weekly basis checking in with the startup, as well as during the workshops that we are doing during the master classes working very closely with the startup on the various fronts. I’m also partially doing the startup coaching.
And then we have an intern who is supporting us as a junior startup coach on those areas from we are at the moment and also looking for a new role and which is the ecosystem lead. we are engaging as well with a big mentor network. So, on that front, permit, mentor network, the whole ecosystem, and bringing that together is very important. And but yeah, we are a very small team of four. And then we are based in in the CBD. So, we are at the moment working out of ACRR FinTech hub at Robinson road and very prominent in the FinTech hubs where also the Singapore FinTech association is located and a number of other startups. And basically, what we are also offering to our students that go through the incubation program is that and they can work alongside with us. So, they also get desks allocated during that time. So, it was quite an exciting time. And once you were allowed back to the office, and we had a number of startups that were based in Singapore that joined us there, I think there’s a lot of interaction going on in such a co-working space and which stimulates and basically you can ask for support and questions anytime you want. But we really have a very open way of working together.

JE: Okay, let me ask two follow-up questions on sort of the office and working together. Because I know when your first group you had an entity from India, so I guess it’s not a requirement that you have to come and work in the office, it’s possible to be in one of the programs virtually, is that correct?

JT: That has obviously changed this year with COVID as it was literally impossible for them to come in. But usually, we do during the master classes require two team members of the start-ups to be here in Singapore physically present and during these one or two weeks, and they’re also working out of the coworking space with us. And this time it wasn’t possible but in the future we are hoping that we can do that again, because that group dynamic and peer learning is extremely valuable for the start-up.

JE: Okay, well, that’s important. And I just want to reinforce what you said that, obviously this year has been exceptional. But in the future, the expectation is, the company that comes to F10 in Singapore needs to have some sort of physical presence and participation there, that that is expected of them. Is that correct?

JT: That’s correct. And we are also covering expenses, so the start-ups do receive 20,000 Singapore dollars for the incubation program. So, basically they can really cover their cost of traveling and hotels. And we are paying for that. So, no issue; should not be an issue for them not to come. So, we have always done that in the past, also in Switzerland.

JE: Okay, let me ask about a term that I didn’t put in the talking points, but you’ve raised it. So, I want to talk about it. What exactly does a mentor do? They’re not part of the core team of four. Do they physically come and give classes? Or is it more just someone to call up to get advice? How would you define a mentor? And how do they go about their work?

JT: Yeah, great question. We do have two kinds of mentors. So, we have one-on- one mentor. So, each startup gets one-on-one mentor that is basically allocated and a mentor throughout the program. And then we have a number of subject matter experts, people from the industry, former founders, really people that do have maybe on the tech side a very, very good understanding of these requirements, or business development or in the really in the financial in the core financial services industry. And they have maybe a great network they can leverage. So, it’s really about supporting an ecosystem being part of that. We are unable to pay the mentors. But we also give them a platform to learn from, from the startup to see what was the latest coming out to have engaged them during the scouting process as well. And then, yeah, during normal times, there will be a lot of networking opportunities on the mentor side.

JE: Okay. Very good. I just want to talk a little bit about regulatory approvals for being an incubator and accelerator. Are you subject to regulatory approvals like a financial institution would be or? Or is it largely an unregulated activity?

JT: It’s an unregulated activity. But it’s a good point that you raise as I think, in Singapore, the regulator is actually extremely supportive for incubators, accelerators in the space of Innovation Centers. So, the Monetary Authority of Singapore is playing a very active role here. And we definitely do appreciate that and have a very close collaboration with them, but we are not subject to regulation.

JE: Okay. So, F10. In Singapore, you’ve been open for a year now, though, it was a somewhat exceptional year. Looking ahead for three years, what is going to change? Is it just looking at expanding all of what you’re doing? Will there be any new directions? And anything you can tell us about there?

JT: Yeah, I think it’s very exciting to look ahead. Obviously, once we have this crisis behind us, I think there will be a lot of opportunities that we will open up. I think, first and foremost, again, we do want to grow Singapore as a hub here. First and foremost, we also want to add new corporate Members, we’re talking to a lot of different organizations at the moment how we how they can become part of F10, then obviously, we want to tap into talent from the region. So, I think building the brand awareness building the brand over here is very crucial for us, among the various FinTech associations, etc. So, we will be traveling as you actually pointed out quite well and we’ll be reaching out to the to the different countries and attracting the talent and to become part of the F10. I think FinTech, the FinTech space is still early stage here in Southeast Asia. I mean, there’s a lot happening in Singapore, for sure. But I see a lot of developments going forward, which we also want to be part of. So yeah, I think is first and foremost growing the platform here and growing the team here, and also being able to deliver great programs for the startups and engaging them and our corporate partners.

JE: Okay, now, I’m just going to look back at the relationship to F10 in Switzerland, because obviously, you’re specializing in the financial sector and FinTech. Switzerland, has a lot of financial institutions and banks, are some of those Swiss financial institutions, whether insurance, banks, custody firms, are they moving to Asia? So, are some of your corporate partners from Switzerland, setting up or looking to set up in Singapore and in growing existing relationships from Switzerland?

JT: Yeah, absolutely. Asia is a growth market for a lot of European incumbents. So, I think, for example, one of our corporate partners is SIX group, they are growing, they’re expanding their business units over here to Asia, but also Julius Baer has been growing quite substantially, in the past, I don’t know 10 to 20 years here in Asia. So, I think that Switzerland and Singapore have always had a very close collaboration. And for many Swiss companies, Singapore is basically the hub towards Asia, at least towards Southeast Asia. And I personally think that this continues to be the case. And not just incumbents, to be honest, I think also startups to expand to Asia, I think Singapore is a very natural first move, because people speak English here, it is quite international, in a way and easy entry into Asia. And from here you can then tackle other markets and other countries in the region.

About Fintech and Incubators/Accelerators

JE: Okay, very interesting. Let’s go to the third section, which is talking about the industry for FinTech incubators and accelerators. Give an overview in a general sense of the FinTech accelerator & incubator industry, is it homogenous, are they are doing sort of similar things or do people specialize in some areas like insure tech or banking, tech? What is the nature of the FinTech incubators and accelerators in general?

JT: Great question. Yeah, I think there are a number of initiatives out there. So, I think in general, there are a number of accelerators and incubators here in Asia here in Singapore especially. And some of them are industry agnostic. So, they’re doing clean tech, agritech, FinTech, so basically, have it all in in one in one program. And some incubators and accelerators focused solely on blockchain. So, there are a number of accelerators out here and incubator that do only blockchain, and some of them mainly in the financial services industry, some of them again, industry agnostic. And for us, where we want to differentiate ourselves is that we have a clear focus on the FinTech and insurtech verticals. And this allows us really also to build, as I mentioned before, a whole ecosystem of mentors, investors, and, you can imagine, if you are an expert in the financial services industry, you might not know as much about the agritech although this is all coming together in a way but and we believe that it’s an asset for us. So, it’s an advantage really to focus on one vertical because the industry is heavy regulated as you know, and then requires quite a lot of expert expertise and knowledge. So that’s really our focus. And we are now basically at the beginning, we started out with mainly focus on incubation program on early-stage startup. But we have now basically split that into two programs during early-stage program and the acceleration program, which is for late-stage startup, which we see now also is more appealing to the corporate partners, as well as to the startup. If you’re early, you’re tackling with different problems than when you’re gaining traction and you have different requirements. That gives you an overview.

JE: Yes. Now, let’s talk about this distinction between the programs because we’ve touched upon it at two points. So far, I had taught a course once where companies, prelisting so still in the private markets, I used to break down into four stages. Stage One was just idea generation proof of concept. Stage two was revenue generation, stage three was when they became profitable for their first year, and stage four was sort of pre-IPO when they had three years of profitability. Now my inference, looking at the two brochures, which we’ll be putting on this banner is that people who go into incubators are in stage one, their pre-revenue. It’s not as clear to me what the accelerator is, is it just for Stage two who are just revenue generating? Or is that also maybe for more mature established companies that have become profitable? Tell us about the type of company in each of those two programs?

JT: Yes, I think you cannot always make a clear cut here. I think it depends on different variables. But and, again, for the for the incubation program, it’s really about startups that have just started out recently. But there needs to be the way we select the startups in that they need to be at least two co-founders, it’s very important for us that there is not just a single founder. And research shows that these startups have more success and they’re more resilient if they’re, if there’s not just one, one founder. So that’s one of the requirements actually. And then they need to be incorporated at the start of the program. So, someone who just has an idea, and but not yet is not yet Incorporated, that doesn’t work, they need to be fully committed as well. So there needs to be full time working on this to team members needs to be full time working on this. So, these are all requirements for the incubation program. So, they are early stage, they have a prototype. And usually, they have not yet raised any money, some of them have maybe raised a family and friends around, let’s say 100,000 processes, basically. And then the acceleration, we require the startup to be at a different stage. So, they have raised at least half a million, which is usually a smaller seed round. And they must have paying clients and they need to make at least 200,000 Singapore dollar annual recurring revenue. Okay, our requirements here about that can also go up to I mean, as I said that the minimum is for us, half a million of they can also have raised a Series A of up to 3 million. And that’s definitely been interesting for us if they see fit, if they are and all these our corporate partners, it is easy for them in the program.

JE: Okay, what about the competitive environment in Singapore? I’m guessing there are lots of incubators, accelerators there. Is it really a competitive environment to compete for the new startups? Which program they will go on? Or do the incubators sort of cooperate or collaborate together? What is the competitive environment?

JT: Personally, I’m always for collaboration. So, I think I do know the guys from the other incubators and accelerators, we do an exchanges on our course. And I think in terms of startup, and there are lots of startups out there, what we’re also seeing is that some startups going from one to the other accelerator or incubator. So, we have also had startups that have already done a program before and very early-stage program, for example, and then join the F10. So, as I as I mentioned before, some incubators and accelerators focused on different phases and stages of the startup So, I think we can support each other here. And I think one thing I have not yet mentioned is actually that many of these incumbents have also run their own innovation centers. So, I think that’s also a very interesting angle and for these innovation centers. And that actually also what we are seeing is that they like to talk with us, and they like to see who is in our program. And if that fits also, and their requirements and their problem statement that they are currently working on, then they basically take the startup and put them into their innovation center and start working with them. So, I think we can all support each other here, I think there is enough space. And people work on different stages. And then also the area of talent that is such a big region. I mean, we have, for example, several startups that come out of India and China would also be very interesting for us. So, as you can imagine, these are and countries with Indonesian is I think, you know, 300 million inhabitants. So, there’s a lot of a lot of activity going on. And a lot of startups in the FinTech space are looking into seeing, of course, that I think it is an attractive market. And I believe we have an attractive value proposition for them. So yeah, all good challenge, like competition is always also healthy to a certain extent,

JE: You use the term ‘Innovation Center’, is that fundamentally different from an accelerator or an incubator or is it quite similar?

JT: There again, there are different concepts of innovation center. So, and to be honest, can be very, very different depending on the organization some innovation centers are having. It’s basically an interface from the outside world, for startups, to get in touch with the corporates, and these people are really the gatekeepers and getting them in touch with the business units and there are other Innovation Centers who have a whole team of techies together with businesspeople that are actually, developing in-house solution that they then want to bring up as new revenue streams and new business models and business units to even develop. So, there’s a whole range of activities going on. Some other innovation centers are more design thinking units within financial organizations, where it is more about cultural change that they are trying to achieve. So, I cannot give you an answer. But there are different interpretations. And some of them are very successful. Some of them are closing again, after some time, so yeah.

JE: Okay. Big choice. Okay. Very interesting. And just to close off this third section, just give us the details of your F10, Singapore’s business model, how do you generate revenue? How do you financially support yourself? What do you demand of either corporate partners or the startups in your system?

JT: Yeah, so we have, basically, say two revenue streams. We have our corporate partners, they’re paying a membership fee. So, we have an innovation partner as well as a strategic partner. And plus, we have additional services that they basically can consume from us. So, this is our main revenue stream that they pay us a certain fee for what we do. And then on the other side, during the incubation program, we are also taking equity. So, we take 4% equity in the next financing round of all the startups that go through the incubation program. But as long as you don’t have an exit you don’t get any cash back, obviously, so it’s not very predictable. But in Switzerland, we have now also set up an investment vehicle that is investing into the startup cycle through the incubation program. So therefore, we can also participate, participate in the upside of, basically all our support that we bring to the startup. So, I think that that’s an interesting model that we are also exploring here in Singapore to invest into startups going through our program.

JE: So, you have aspirations that some of your startups one day will become unicorns, list, and then you’ll take your billion dollars and retire. Is that the plan?

JT: Well, if F10 would belong to me, then that would be my dream. Yes, but I’m employed here so I cannot take that money, but it will be very exciting to have. And to have exits, of course, in the future, and I’m sure there will be exits and is going isn’t going to be a unicorn? I don’t know because by this, yeah, it’s exciting. It’s exciting to see the development at the moment.

Case Study (overview of programs)

JE: Okay, that’s great. So, let’s go to our final section, which normally is a case study. But in in your case, we’re going to look at the two brochures that you’ve given to me, that we will add on to this viewing about the incubator, which you’ve already run once in the spring and the accelerator, which you’re starting to run now. Let’s just talk about these in in general. You’ve talked about the criteria for getting into the program, I’m talking about the incubator here, they need to be incorporated, they need a minimum of two founders, they need to be physically committing to attending the master classes, and have a validated proof of concept, or prototype of what you’ve done. So, the next one incubator is going to start next March, but you’re in the process of reviewing applications. Now, where does that stand? Have you chosen any companies? Or will they all be chosen in next February?

JT: No, we have actually just selected the top 35, I believe we have invited them for selection phase, mid-December, it will be three days where we invite them for half an hour teaching and then Q&A with a panel of our corporate partners and mentors and experts. And after these three days, we will then decide about the top 15, which we invite again, for a very top 15 to 20 depends, on how many make it to the next round for speed-dating that would also be in person, but obviously not happening now. So, we have this the second selection, the final selection of the top 10 and it’s going to take place in January or early February. And then these top 10 will be contacted and we will sign a term sheet with them. Then we announce it, and these 10 start-ups will then join the program in in March.

JE: Now let me be clear on something. Because on the brochure, you have the interviews, which I guess apply to the top 35. That’s straightforward. What’s the difference between an interview to a startup and speed dating? What is speed dating? How is it different from an interview or evaluation?

JT: Yeah, so that’s been a more in-depth discussion. So, we are inviting a number of mentors as well, as a number of our corporate partners will bring in a number of their colleagues from the different areas and really the experts on this specific topic. And there will be specific interviews happening throughout the whole day, actually, two days as it is. And really, it will be really about rating start-ups very deeply, and getting all the necessary information for us to make the decision about who is in and who is not in.

JE: Is it in all cases, just the two founders that come to these interviews or speed dating or, if they have larger staffs, do you encourage them to bring more of their staff for these interviews?

JT: Yeah, there it’s really up to them. And we have had interviews where we sit with five of their team on their side. I mean, now it’s virtual so they can basically bring in as many as they want from their side. So, I think, especially if they talk to experts, maybe they want to bring in some of their engineers as well, and who can answer all the technical details if this is required. So very much to the startup, but then mostly it’s two co-founders that that joined the people.

JE: Okay. Now, you talked about the masterclasses and five master classes in the incubator. Give us an idea of a topic for one of these masterclasses what do they cover in them?

JT: Yeah, so I think for example, we start within the first two, two weeks, when we start with the with the program, we focus on the ideation part, we focus on vision mission. Having really a master plan, where do you want to be three years. So, it’s a workshop where we get there. And then later on, in the prototyping, prototyping master classes, it’s really about prototype testing. So, we bring in different experts from, from the industry, who go through a predefined exercise, which each of the startup sets up and gets very important information about their, their offering about their product. So, we try it, we really try to make it very hands on. I think that’s important. We, I mean, some of the some of the topics can be consumed on YouTube, or any other platform. But where we ask the value is we are working with them, we do workshops, we help them to define and refine their value proposition or their products, etc. very much hand-on, very much workshop style.

JE: Sure. Okay, now there is a term you use on this page that was really interesting and I’ll get to it in a minute. Because when I was a little boy, four years old, out in the backyard of my parents’ home, my dad built me a sandbox. Now, I’m guessing your sandbox was not the same as mine. What is the F10? sandbox? What is that?

JT: Yeah, so in Switzerland we have setup a sandbox, the sandbox is basically a secure environment where FinTech’s can test their solution. And our corporate partner can provide some data, obviously data that doesn’t contain any specific user data. So, its pre-prepared data for a time. But then this environment allows the startup to test their solution with our corporate partners. So, with anyone who was offering solutions within the Sandbox, they can access that, and they can try out their solution. And really, in a sense, testing whether their value proposition and their solution holds to what they promise and especially as you know, all the questions around security, etc. And so, instead of plugging their solution directly into a corporate into a bank or an insurer, they go first into the sandbox, with their solution tested out and before it’s been released into the bank or the insurer. So that’s really the idea behind the sandbox that you have an environment where you can test your solution before, we then take it to the next level into the bank or whoever the partner is.

JE: It reminds me of my university teaching days where there would be lectures, but then there would also be something we called it labs, where they would go into an area. I was in the finance, we had a financial lab, we would have all sorts of simulations, but it was with it was fake data, it wasn’t plugged into the real world, where they just sort of experimented in a hypothetical basis. It sounds a little bit like sort of the lab application in a university setting.

JT: Yeah, you can see that way exactly. Okay, it’s a safe environment where you cannot do any harm really. And then you can really test your solution.

JE: Great. Let’s turn to the second handout, the accelerator batch, which is the second document we’ll put on the site now. It’s a little bit different from the incubator because in the incubator, you have four points below before selection, application, interview, speed dating, announcement, whereas here, you just have application period, announcement date, and it’s just a month apart. So is there not the same number of extensive interviews and speed dating for the accelerator, is the selection process much, much shorter and less than in the incubator.

JT: It’s also extensive, but to be honest, this time, we had a bit less time. So, we had to do it within a shorter, shorter timeframe. But it is a similar process, start- ups come in, they teach and then we have a speed dating and then we select those that are relevant.

JE:  Okay, so conceptually, it’s the same process, you just need to compress it a little bit this time. So, you’ve got three master classes in this as opposed to five in the incubator? Do those master classes have a different focus given that the company’s more developed in accelerator than in incubators? Is it more marketing or sales or stuff like that?

JT: Yeah, exactly. So very much the focus very much on business development in the first master class. And, and the second master class by scaling organization, as well as a POC workshop, where we bring the startups together with our corporate partners, although this happens actually throughout the whole process. And then the last masterclass is more about fundraising, and also a demo day towards the end. And we work, however, with startups throughout the three months and by the way over throughout the five months, very closely, our coaches, are checking with them on a weekly basis, and see whether they progress as they progress without partners, and where we can support them. So again, we try to be very hands on to really add value and make sure that they can reach that next stage.

JE: Okay, very good. So now that covers all the points I had down on my list of talking points. Just before we close out, is there anything you’d like to raise, discuss, promote, that I didn’t think of asking to you give me your last chance to close off with anything you’d like to add?

JT: No, I think, although you are based in Suzhou, of course, we are looking also for startups in China, though very, very much welcoming any Chinese startups as well. I have with myself, as I mentioned earlier, two years in Beijing, half a year in Shanghai, as well as a year in Chengdu, so very much connected also to China. And yes, will be very excited to see both applications coming out of China.

JE: It will be interesting next year, because this year, there’s clearly been a trend where Singapore is becoming the international location for international operations of Chinese entities, particularly the big technology firms. What’s really been interesting in the last week is this proposed break up or re-regulation of the big firms and whether that will create more competition, more innovations, and more startups in China. So, it’s going to be very interesting next year, whether we’ll get a much larger wave of new FinTech’s if the sort of the quasi monopoly of these few big giants is broken up and Singapore seems to be the first place to go for Chinese financial institutions when they leave the mainland.

JT: Yeah, I think it’s an interesting development. And I’m curious how it’s going to play out. So yeah, but I think Singapore is a very, very good place to be and very international, with great access to the region. So, I can only encourage start-ups as well as incumbent, established companies to look into Singapore as an option.

End.